Parenting Teenagers (12-18) Support Group

Sadly with seperated parents there is usually one who 'needs to feel loved more' and usually to the point of compromising the well-being of the child just to be the 'good guy'.

I find it very interesting that religion and promoting a child with guns falls into the same sentence but that's just me and I'll leave it alone.

I can say I understand your brothers views about the brain washing and stuff but before he competely takes these views why doesn't he research it? Get info on the program itself, speak to people running it and find out first hand what is going to be taught? I really don't see it as odd that a young boy would be inclined in this direction but I would place bets that the son isn't aware himself of what the program really entails, just heard a piece and has come to his own conclusions.

As the aunt or the father I wouldn't go to the child without hard facts behind me. I wouldn't go in with the outward attitude of being totally against but with questions of why the child is interested, where his draw comes from and piece by piece go over the tension points. Going in armed with knowledge may dissuade the child from wanting to go or may show the dad that it's not as bad as he thought. Else maybe a few compromises maybe made that make both parties satisfied with the situation.

Chris333, thank you for your time and your clear understanding of the situation.
Yes, the mom has found the "button" that attracts the son. and is using it to the fullest to get control and to view his father as the bad guy who is preventing him from enrolling in theis "cool" program.

My brother has researched it. The academy is on the surface a civilian program. but it is taught by retired military people. and the kids get the full military uniform and are called sargents and commanders and such. they are lured into this by telling them that they get to learn to fly airplanes for free.

My brother has offered his son that if it is the flying lessons he is attracted to, he would get him some private lessons, but the lure is the "coolness" of being in the "Academy" and getting to hang out with coll guys who wear the hats and uniforms.
I have not broached the subject so far. But I don't know how to tell him what he thinks is cool, is not really cool.

My family is so upset to see him go this direction. we are witnessing the brainwashing is already happening. We don't want to make the mom be the bad guy by telling him that she is using these guns and academy to buy his love and attention.

Another thing the mom is doing to get to him is to buy him this drink that looks likes beer, smells like beer and I think i t has one percent alcohol. She is compromising his well being to be the "good guy" like you said. She just bought him his third paint gun and a new rubber bullet gun. and they kids don't wear eye protection when they play with the rubber bb's. Could this consttitue neglect?

There is no reason to provide this to a 13 year old. Is this against the law and would it be considered providing alcohol to a minor?
He reports that he tastes his mom's beer and wine.
How do we wake Nate up to see the situation without making mom the bad guy? We are concerned.

He is very intelligent and reads books. Can you suggest a book that teaches kids, peace, instead of war. And choosing right from wrong.

I know that war is on the mind of many , and some may say that we need soldiers. But at 13 we think he has to stay away from this fascination with guns.

thanks you for your time and interest. I appreciate any help or advice you may have for me.

This is a really hard situation, and unfortunately there is no easy answer. Having got my kids from 0 - 19 years old the lesson I have learnt is that they can and do make their own minds up and often seem wiser than their parents.

Hopefully he will grow out of it. Sometimes we cannot stop something, but we can present a clear alternative lifestyle and stick to it firmly enough for it to speak to the child.

It's normal for a child this age to be interested in the military and guns. My 14 year old son wants to join the Air Force and join ROTC at school. I support his decision because this is what he wants to do.

To me, this situation sounds more like a tug-of-war between the two parents than it does a real concern over the child being interested in guns and the military. Since you are the father's sister, of course you will take his side. You compare the mom and dad as if, clearly, he is the better parent. But, it's never that clear cut.

I don't believe it's a good idea for you and your husband to try to convince this child to think the way his dad thinks. Honestly, I don't think it's your place or your business and shame on the dad for trying to drag the whole family into this bad situation. I believe this would alienate the child even more from your side of the family.

I have personally been in this situation and both parents try to dangle goodies in front of the children and entice them to choose their side.

What did you mean at the end of your post by "now the tables have turned"?

"Motivating young people to become better citizens". I was in jrotc in highschool and that was our motto. I just graduated, I'm 17. It was a great program. Discipline, morals, health, fitness, strength, unity, respect, integrity, honesty, courage, faith, loyalty, all of this I learned from that class. Best group of friends I ever had. Smartest kids, honest and really caring, and we depended on each other all through school. In these and other programs a lot of times parents are confused about them, thinking it's all about the military and possibly brainwashing type situations. It's not! Our program actually promoted it as a citizenship class, not a military propaganda or enlisting class. There is NO military commitment in these programs until college rotc. These are great programs and are not bad or unsafe in any way. I trusted my two jrotc instructors more than anyone else in my life, and they helped me grow up to be the person I am. They fostered a great relationship with me and helped me in all aspects of my life. I will always be greatful for such caring instructors. The boy may not understand all this yet, and may still be stuck in the "o0o0h shiny uniforms!" stage but he will come to appreciate the strength and disipline he learns. Also, these programs do not just throw 12 gauge shotguns into kids hands. Trust me, in school, we only had oldfashioned 0383's with lead filled barrels, basically demilitarized rifles that didn't fire, only were used for drill, and we didn't even touch them till Sophmore year. True, he may not be cut out for it, and it might be all wrong for him and his situation. I can't really speak for the academy or other institution, but I would think they run on the same system. They are really safe and very influencial programs that give kids potential to better themselves. I would highly recommend to anyone. Just my $0.02

No, I don't think you should get involved at all in talking to the boy.

Not sure about the drink that smells like beer, never heard of it. But I'm sure your brother knew what she was like when they got married and if they had stayed married the boy would have some of the same interests he has now that his mother has and some that his dad has. But it wouldn't be looked at in the same way, so negatively.
Maybe he'll take a bit from both parents and turn out just right.

Caspiano,

just wanted to share a little with you...i read and related to your post earlier, but hadn't had the opportunity to respond until now...

first of all, you may want to reread the post from medicaudrey...and remember the saying "from the mouth of babes..."

also the post from mikeswife is good.... and then consider my rambling post...it's going to be long...but i am in similar situation except it's a little reversed....ready...here goes...

i have a 14 year old son from a previous marriage. His dad and I were married for 3 years and separated when he was 2 and divorced when he was around 7.

eversince he was 2 i have had physical custody and shared joint custody with his dad.

i consider myself to be conservative, religious and strict...

i consider his dad to liberal, not religious, and more leniant...

but i know that we both want what is best for our son...we just have different ideas of what that is...and that is normal...

now while i did not want this divorce, and it took me over 10 years to get over this divorce, we never used our son as a pawn...

we had very different ideas when it came to raising our son...but we never let it get in the way of our son...it was very important to us that he know and understand, that just because we didn't like or love each other, didn't mean that we didn't love him...

no matter what happens, i will always be his mother, and my ex husband will always be his dad...

i never tried to keep my son from his dad, or his new family for that matter...

i never told my son anything negative about his dad...

and i never used my son in any way to try to hurt my ex-husband (his dad)...

and vice versa...his dad was the same way...


here is where the tables turn...

Growing up, I had fun on my bicycle, my ex-husband didn't like bicycles (weird)
when my son got into bikes, I bought him a bike, I taught him to ride the bike, etc...his dad didn't care one way or the other....

when we were together and for the first 4 years of his life, my son and his dad had long hair...well, one friday his dad picked him up with long hair and brought him back on sunday afternoon with SHORT HAIR!!!! i was a little upset, but what could i do...that was his son too, and he decided he didn't want his son to have long hair anymore so i have to accept that...whether i like or not...

same thing with church...i started my son of in church with VBS when he was 4 y/o, then he started going to Sunday School in the third grade, and is now fully emersed in the youth group, by his own choice...i showed him something, and then let him make his decision based on what i showed him...i grew up in church, and felt strongly that it would be something good for him to experience...his dad did not...but we both let him decide for himself....

when our son was about 11 he go into the gun thing because his stepmoms family introduced it to him...did i have a fit about it...no!
heck when i was a kid i loved guns and anything that had to do with them (Charlies Angels were my heros)...but i did insist that he learn the dangers of guns, that he learn to respect guns, and that he treat all guns as if they were real...and that he understand the permanent effect of shooting a real gun...you can't take that back...i even bought him a BB gun that he used to take to his grandma's (my 85y/o) mom and play target practice with it and with her!
He has since outgrown guns, he still likes them but they are not the greatest thing in the world right now...

now he's on to bigger and better things...Cars and Motorcycles...his stepmom recently brought this nice little topic up and my wonderful son, doesn't want a car...no he wants a motorcycle like mommy has..his stepmom told him ohhh, well don't expect your dad to help you out with THAT...he'll get you a car, but theres no way in hell he's getting you a motorcycle...now i already knew this because he didn't want me to have a motorcycle when we were together, much less his son!!!!
Am I going to get him a motorcycle? I don't know yet...he needs to show me that hes responsible enough to get a motorcycle the same way he did with guns...and even then i might not get him one...but it sure makes me feel good that he wants to be like me in the sense that i love motorcycles and he does too!....
now onto the military school thing....military school is a good thing for boys and girls (if they have them), just like jrotc is good for public school students...but they shouldn't be forced into it and it shouldn't be used as a punishment...i am all for military school/programs, and his dad is seriously against them...but at the end it is his choice...i discussed this option with my son, and he said he wasn't interested in it so that's it..he's was in the magnet program in elementary school, was identified as gifted and talented, and went on to a public Vanguard Middle School, and in the fall will be entering the IB Program at our local High School...he maintains a A Average, participates in atheletics...and overall is becoming a great young man with a little bit of me and a little bit of his dad...
Note this though, i decided to go into the Army during my junior year in HS...my mom told me not to do it, my family told me not to do it, my friends told me not to do it...but i did it...and I loved it...and i developed a love for my country unlike any other love i have ever known...would i give up my life for my son, Yes! would i give up my life for my country Yes! Do i want my son to make that sacrifice? only if he chooses...Does his dad want him to make that sacrifice? HELL NO!!!...does he want to make that sacrifice? He doesn't know yet...sometimes yes, sometimes no, but it will be his decision....

Caspiano, nicely put, the moral of this LLLOOONNNGGGG story is this....

if Nate's mom conspires against his dad and trys to keep him from his dad, Nate will grow to resent her....

and

if you, your family, and Nate's dad conspire against his mother and try to keep him away from his mother, when Nate grow's up and realizes what you all did, he will resent you and resent all of you....

Nate is a person too, he's a little person right now with feelings, opinions and thoughts of his own...and whether he admits it or not, the two most important people in his life are his mom and his dad...and he wants to know that he is loved by both of them

If his mom SHOWS him her ideas, values, morals, and passions....and

If his dad SHOWS him his ideas, values, morals, and passions....

Nate will grow up to make decisions based on what both his parents have showed him and taught him...and he will have the best parts of both of them....

I seriously believe, unfortunately, that as adults, we tend to forget what it was like to be a child, an adolescent, a teenager, and in doing so, we fail to realize that that was the time we learned how to be the adults that we are....

Just wanted to show you another point of view.

I apologize seriously for the length of this post...

But i believe the most important thing to remember is Nate, because he along with my son, and all the other children, adolescents, and teenagers are what really matter and are truly our future....

Good Luck

-DR-

Thank you all for your heartfelt contributions and suggestions. I really appreciate your time and sincerity.

I have found your ideas very helpful and have clarified in my mind as how to proceed in this sensitive situation.

I do believe that this situation is complex and both parents have tried hard to “win” the boy. The result has been a tug a war of power and control and the end result of over indulgence.

In my observation, I think the wife is abusing her custody power. She is limiting visitations and I think in the long run the boy will resent her for not letting him have time with dad.

Especially now that she has won this "round" and dangling goodies (guns) has won the affection and attention of the boy, she has become emboldened and keeps saying, “ if you don’t like it go to court!!” … “ I know you don’t have the money to do it”

I find this attitude hurtful to the child.
One can’t run to court for every infraction you know!

Since both parents are so opposite of each other in values and basic life principals, I wish they never had brought up a child into this world. But he is here now and they must learn to deal with it better, so he doesn’t get damaged.

I personally have a very warm and loving relationship with him and want to keep it that way.

I go fishing with him and do art projects when we do have a chance to see him.
I am going to let the parents deal with the major decisions and stay out of this. Thank you of confirming my inclination.


The only thing I would like to say is the touchy notion of brain washing.

I think it does happen in the military and in some religious organizations.

So I must say I do worry about it for him being exposed to the military ideas too soon before he has had a chance to experience the world better and formulate an informed perspective.

I have seen it happen to young kids who see the army as a way out.

And people who are brainwashed, don’t often know it.

I guess those of us who have strong beliefs and values in any field, being politics or religion, could accuse the other of being brainwashed! ?

Brain washing is non-violent and sometimes subtle method that uses mind control techniques to convince a person to abandon some of their basic beliefs and adopt the beliefs of the new organization or group and I hope this does not happen to him.
So I am going to trust Medicaudrey's judgment views of what happens in these kind of academies.

I respect the dedicated young people who defend our country. Please don’t get me wrong.

But some kids who think they are going to get to travel and see the world and learn to fly fancy airplanes, and wear uniforms and get stars on the jackets so on……..end up dead or lose limbs without knowing what they are fighting for.

My hope is that my nephew, having had parents of such opposite values, will be able to make a nice blend of strong social values, peace, justice, respect, and self determination and grow to become a wonderful citizen.
Respectfully. Caspiano

I live in the South where guns are just a part of life. I realize not everyone feels this way and we're all entitled to our opinion. Just a thought - would dad be willing to give his son's new interest a try? My husband and son played paintball together and had a blast. They've also been to the local gun range and did some target shooting. It was a great father-son experience and the emphasis is on safety. Best of luck to all of you!

Thanks Zigzag,

I will suggest this to dad see if he wouldl consider participating in his son's paint ball gun activities.

This is actually a good way for them to share something his son likes and he can show support, talk about safety, and not come across as disapproving and alienating his son.